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February 6th, 2013 01:15 AM #6
It sounds like you will not be reading this but i have to say that you are right. I don't think that they are intentionally being classist/racist: they just represent a certain point of view ie. upperclass white people. I don't think that they realize that names are a very sensitive issue because they are so connected with culture and class. I think much of the negativity needs to be removed from this website, but then again Pam and Linda own the site and can express their opinions freely, of course; they should just understand that their opinions are reaching people all over the world and that there is a strong possibility that they will alienate and offend people when they express negative opinions without much thought.
February 6th, 2013 02:39 AM #8
I think you make some valid points, but the only two implicitly barely offensive remarks in that blog post was that 1) "clearly" without the author's exclusive list of names one should NOT use, we are but lost sheep who make bad naming decisions, and 2) anyone who has named a baby in the past decade has done a poorer job than those of generations past.
No mention of race, nor class; I didn't get the vibe at all. I know 10 people with names from that list, and coincidentally, all are people from Canada, and there is a mix of backgrounds from Irish to Ukranian (none of them are black), and most are my age. Of the first 3 names on the list, Arcadia, Atlas & Bliss... well, I worked with an EA earlier this year named Arcadia and she is a wonderful, intelligent, innovative woman (she's the Ukranian). I love the name Atlas. I've had a soft spot for Bliss for years.
That's 3 in a row I disagree with, so whatever the rest of the list is, I take it with a grain of salt since I don't think it holds any value for myself (I wouldn't have continued to read if I weren't going to reply to this post anyway, even though it's totally a lost cause if you've left the site).
If one wants some academic, unbiased, objective facts about names, a blog written by two people who share subjectivities (and quite successfully) is not the place to be doing 'research'. I love the forums, and I'm quite capable of forming my own opinions and doing my own research with language academies, journals, factual etymological sources, and travel. I'm becoming baffled as to why lately there's been so much backlash against the authors when they clearly state that these are their opinions. Do I think databases should be objective and correct when intended as a resource? Absolutely! Am I aware that this database does not have that quality? Obviously. Does it matter? Not at all, since I know how to use google and think for myself. Everyone should be thinking critically about any information they come across.
Last edited by lucialucentum; February 6th, 2013 at 02:45 AM.Lucia
travel. teach. learn.
20-something, name aficionada
Sela Ivy, Vivian Lilac and Bastian Ivor "Baz", Fletcher Gideon
February 6th, 2013 02:45 AM #10
On the one hand, you bring up an interesting point. Why is Serenity different from Grace? The blog posts frequently are opinion pieces rather than well-researched, mores the pity, but honestly what do you expect? The operative word is blog, not book.
On the other hand, you're incorrect. This site frequently discusses the thorny issues of class, and, less frequently, race, surrounding naming practices; in fact in the Girls forum there is currently a very active thread discussing "trashy" names which garnered a lot of skirt-gathering. It's part of what makes the subject so compelling, fascinating, and occasionally uncomfortable.
It's funny how quickly you drew the racial conclusion. I actually think you're factually incorrect there, too, especially in your dichotomy. I'd be willing to bet my shirt that there are more white Serenitys than there are black or Hispanic (and, I think it's gotten it's downmarket reputation because of Sailor Moon, and the kinds of people who name their children after Sailor Moon characters). Harmony, Journey and Karma are white hippie names; Merry is an old-school name popular in England more than a century ago; Patience is very very white; Sincere and Trust are extremely rarely given, and sound more like Christian African immigrant names; Messiah, Prince, King, Venus and Precious are African-American; Destiny and Heaven would belong to the group currently being discussed in the Girls forum. In short, quite a grab bag, united only by the belief that they are "too much."
The names you suggested as 'white' and acceptable are equally diverse. The first nine definitely strike me as posher white names, but Haven and Chastity belong to the downmarket group, Orion and Blaze are more frequently black; Poet and Story are faux-Bohemian; Aria is given to nearly everyone; Nehemiah is given to Orthodox Jews, Odin and Gaia are hipster names (so posh, but a totally different flavor); etc.
Of course you won't be discussing this rather interesting grab-bag of names nor dissecting the shades of gray that separate Felicity from Chastity, not after the game of Politically Correct Bingo that was your sign-off post, which is really too bad. (Btw I got bingo! after 'offended,' 'prejudice,' 'Black-with-a-capital-B,' 'ignorance,' and 'First Nations Community.' at first I wasn't sure if it was a deleted page from Stuff White People Like.)Blade, MD
XY: Antoine Raphael
XX: Cassia Viviane Noor
Aurea * Emmanuelle * Endellion * Fleur * Jacinda * Lysandra * Melisande * Myrrine * Rosamond * Seraphine * Sylvana * Thea * Verity / Blaise * Cyprian * Evander * Jules * Laurence * Lionel * Malcolm * Marius * Quentin * Rainier
كنوز الصحراء الشرقية Hayat _ Qamar _ Sahar _ Maysan _ Farah / Altair _ Fahd _ Faraj _ Khalil _ Tariq
February 6th, 2013 03:07 AM #12Senior Member
- Join Date
- Jan 2012
I think I'm offended by how badly you got offended.Imagination is more important than knowledge. Knowledge is limited. Imagination encircles the world. - Albert Einstein
Girls: Seraphine, Kristabel, Magdalena, Shiloh, Opal, Jobie, Calla, Seeley, Noelle, Mara, Lucille
Boys: Robin, Gabriel, Mackenzie, Nash, Phillip, Raphael, Edmund, Abraham, Lewis, Pierce, Link
Current Crushes: Mackie and Devlin
February 6th, 2013 03:10 AM #14