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  1. #161
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Location
    USA
    Posts
    294
    @joyfulmomto8- Congratulations! 11 is an exciting number. Will pray that everything goes well for you.

    @lineska- We have decided to wait to find out the gender this time too. Neither is better in my mind, I just enjoy surprises!
    Wow, you have quite the moving project ahead of you. On the bright side, it seems that you have enough space to make it work.

    @missusaytch- No one's opinion is worthless. You are right, footling breach is an extremely dangerous position and should never be taken lightly. I am glad that mother and baby survived the situation.

    @alfiejoe- That sounds horrible. I've never had that problem, but my sister used to all the time. I remember her shutting herself in her room with the lights off and buried under the covers all day long. A friend of mine also had demobilizing migraines. Both she and my sister found out that they had gluten allergies and since then their migraines have disappeared, except for the days when they accidentally eat gluten. This of course may not be your case, but it might be worth checking with an allergen specialist. Also, you are probably already doing this, but drinking lots of water may help reduce your symptoms.
    I agree, no matter what you will make it work, and your baby will be just fine.

    @grecianern- Congratulations and welcome! I'm due in Sept, so we both just made it. It's very exciting!
    Mama of two beautiful boys!

    Like arrows in the hand of a warrior,
    So are the children of one’s youth.
    Happy is the man who has his quiver full of them;
    ~Psalm 127:4-5a

  2. #163
    Join Date
    Oct 2012
    Location
    Santa Clarita
    Posts
    919
    @blade, I could not agree more about Ricki Lake and her irresponsible BS. I actually went to a screening of The Business of Being Born in Seattle when it was first being released/promoted and could not believe how utterly unscientific and sensationalized it all was. It seemed as if Ricki had made the whole thing as a strongly emotional reaction to what she viewed as a negative childbirth experience (i.e., things did not go exactly the way she had envisioned, but she and her baby were fine). It was kind of scary how many people are irrationally committed to things going a certain way during labor and delivery. So ironic, because parenting itself demands flexibility!
    Mom to James Daniel (10) William Joseph (9), Elise Marie (7), and Zachary Allan (1)
    http://letterstoauntkay.blogspot.com/

    TTC #5
    Serena (Seri), Audrey, Rose, Naomi, Diana, Kate, Adele, Georgia, Lucy, Linnea, Clara
    Thomas Christopher, Henry, Orin, Arthur, Samuel, Seth

    DH's "approved" list:
    Seri, Naomi, Amy, Diana, Lucy, Kate/Katie/Katherine, Audrey
    Thomas ("maybe")

  3. #165
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Location
    Ontario, Canada
    Posts
    3,208
    Quote Originally Posted by missusaytch View Post
    All I know is this: if I am blessed with a baby, whether I give birth in a tub or not, I want to be at most a few yards away from about 20 people who gave a sh*tload of money to universities. I want 72 advanced degrees in the room with me. I want Dr. Blade, et al, within touching distance. I want a gazillion hours of experience, every drug and apparatus known to man, and basically every tool at the disposal of Western medicine on the same floor with me. Because it's my BABY. My BABY.

    I don't care how transcendent and awesome it is to give birth at home. I don't care if Freya and Aphrodite and Isis appear to me and lovingly stroke my dreadlocks as my boyfriend and I consume the placenta in our birthing tub while little Ostara is decidedly NOT being Apgar tested. I don't see any compelling reason in the world for making some big point about western medicine at the expense of my baby's safety.

    Y'all do what y'all want with y'all's babies. As for me and mine, we're birthing in hospitals with doctors. The best we can find.
    Well said! Love it!
    Ttc a baby brother or sister for Luther Wolf!

  4. #167
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Location
    Western Pennsylvania
    Posts
    1,228
    Quote Originally Posted by missusaytch View Post
    Ok. I have a little story. Let me start out with the caveat that I have never been pregnant and I am so not a doctor or a scientist. I write humorous blog posts for a living.

    When I first started trying to conceive I started reading about natural fertility measures. (I have since decided, on the advice of my doctor, to take more aggressive measures, but that's another topic.) My research - correctly defined above by Blade as reading opinions, which I think is fine as long as you realize you're reading opinions - led me to reading about natural birth.

    My friend - I'll call her Susie - has had four children, 3 of them in hospitals. With #3 she has a bad experience with her epidural. The anesthesiologist was kind of, idk, not incompetent but maybe having a bad day, who knows. Long story short, she ended up with what I think is called a spinal headache. It was horrible, from what she tells me. Her friend is a doula, and talked her into having #4 naturally at home.

    They got a big tub for the living room. She got herself a midwife and started practicing breathing or whatever the hell. She ended up having something called prodromal labor. Correct me if that's wrong. Basically she was contracting pretty badly for a few weeks and it sucked. Then it was real labor time. They waited a long time to call the MW, and then it took her a long time to get there so when she arrived sh*t was getting real.

    And then all the sudden the MW screamed at Susie to get out of the tub. The baby was presenting footling breach. The MW started saying, "I can't do this," and instructed Dad to call 911.

    The way Susie explained it to me, based on what the MW told her later, footling breach is dangerous because the baby is coming out of you, instead of butt first like the regular breach presentation, feet-first, like your vagina is a water slide. And supposedly a lot of babies feel air and have a shrug reflex at the unfamiliar sensation, which makes their shoulders stick in the birth canal. Anyway I don't know if I've explained that correctly or how accurate that is, but the MW made Susie aware later that her life and the baby's were in significant danger.

    Happily, Baby E. was born safely, with about 8 burly, fascinated City of Richardson, Texas firefighter/paramedics standing behind them in the living room watching.

    For a few days, Susie was freaked out. She rethought her decision to birth at home in light of the fact that she and her baby almost died. Her husband described E's little blue foot coming out of her, thinking the baby was already dead.

    Then a week later, after a lot of "reassuring" by her doula and midwife, she was extolling the virtues of home birth again.

    I don't know the statistics of home born vs. hospital birth. I don't particularly care. I am all for natural birth if that's what makes you happy, but I don't think giving birth screaming in a tub with your vegan boyfriend cradling you makes you morally superior to the lady in the next room reading magazines through her labor because she had an epidural.

    All I know is this: if I am blessed with a baby, whether I give birth in a tub or not, I want to be at most a few yards away from about 20 people who gave a sh*tload of money to universities. I want 72 advanced degrees in the room with me. I want Dr. Blade, et al, within touching distance. I want a gazillion hours of experience, every drug and apparatus known to man, and basically every tool at the disposal of Western medicine on the same floor with me. Because it's my BABY. My BABY.

    I don't care how transcendent and awesome it is to give birth at home. I don't care if Freya and Aphrodite and Isis appear to me and lovingly stroke my dreadlocks as my boyfriend and I consume the placenta in our birthing tub while little Ostara is decidedly NOT being Apgar tested. I don't see any compelling reason in the world for making some big point about western medicine at the expense of my baby's safety.

    Y'all do what y'all want with y'all's babies. As for me and mine, we're birthing in hospitals with doctors. The best we can find.
    I know you got some flack for writing this, but I agree with you wholeheartedly. I don't look down on anybody else's choices, but like you I prefer every medical treatment available as well as many staff possible should I need it in case the worst case scenario happens to me and my baby. I have never cared if I can't have a specific birthing plan because it goes against hospital policies. I do not like IV's for example but they've proved medically essential so I've sucked it up and not complained about it. Because at the end of the day it's all about what's best for my baby. I want my baby to be born healthy, and remain healthy. I don't think myself better or worse than somebody who opts for a homebirth. It's about what feels right to me.

    And also, I don't see how this is off topic in a pregnant forum where just about everything gets discussed. True it could be debated about further in it's own separate forum, but there's nothing that states it as being off limits in this one.

    Furthermore @ Rin, I think it was rather condescending of you to basically say that this poster had no right posting here at all. Blade, for example, is very active in all threads because she has solid knowledge to offer being a medical professional, but to the best of my knowledge is not currently pregnant. I don't see you lambasting her. If you don't agree with Missus's post that's fine and dandy, but don't sit there and think you have any right banning her (or anybody else) from offering an opinion. Even if that opinion is based off of her friend's experience. You have the option available to you to block seeing her posts, and mine for that matter if it truly bothers you.
    Not so done having children after all. We're not ready for TTC quite yet but when we do get pregnant,the husband handed sole naming rights over to his name obsessed wife!

    Bouncing Baby Boy: Tristan Marcel * Ambrose Galahad* Gabriel Beauregard
    Little Lady: Josephine Adele * Lena Josephine* Lorelei Nicole* Fleur Josephine

  5. #169
    Join Date
    Sep 2012
    Location
    Los Angeles
    Posts
    4,519
    Thanks @gigi and @missUSH. You are quite right, I am not pregnant, though am secretly part of the TTC crowd. I do wonder whether or not I'm butting in sometimes so it's nice to hear that my perspective is somewhat interesting (though if is crosses the line, please let me know).

    @missUSH, you are entirely right about footling breech. It's by far the most dangerous presentation because the feet and lower body of a baby are so much smaller, in diameter, than the head and shoulders. Since the umbilical cord-- the baby' lifeline-- enters the baby's body at the level of the umbilicus (obviously), when the legs and lower body slip out the cord slips out too. It is then compressed, smashed against the vaginal wall and the pelvic outlet, by the baby's upper body and/or head. The baby is therefore partially or completely deprived of oxygen. Those little legs and lower body can exit the cervix before it's anywhere close to 10cm dilated, so it can be a loooong time before the entire baby is delivered, and all the while the umbilical cord is compressed. This condition is called head entrapment and it is truly life-threatening, an obstetric emergency. In many case series the *mortality* (not brain damage, not cerebral palsy, but mortality) of footling breech babies is 30%. (The figure usually quoted by OBs is 20-25%-- NOT in a hospital, these are 'natural' case series largely from the third world and homebirth statistics, as scanty as those are). At home or in a birthing center there are absolutely no interventions available to save these babies.

    Frank breech-- where the baby's butt is the presenting part, with the legs straight up next to the head-- is the safest since the diameter of the hindquarters is roughly that of the head, and since the legs somewhat protect the umbilical cord. However, once the baby is delivered to the level of the umbilicus it is is the attendant's job to immediately assist the delivery-- basically, pull on the baby in conjunction with maternal pushing-- to minimized the amount of time the cord is compressed by the head/upper body.

    Even frank breech, safe though it is, is associated with a 2-4x increase in perinatal mortality when delivered vaginally, in the US, in hospitals, due to the cord compression. That's why many obstetricians have a blanket no-vaginal breech policy, and only perform c-sections.
    Last edited by blade; February 17th, 2013 at 04:45 PM.
    Blade, MD

    XY: AR
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